The interview is over. Now that he has answered all my questions, Thomas Frank has a question for me.
“Are you competitive?” he says. I hesitate, so it laughs a bit thin to my taste. “Because we are competitive,” he says.
We have arranged a game of Padel on the field that they have built on the Training Bond of Brentford. Me and my partner, John, against Frank and his highly valued assistant coach Kevin O'Connor, who is a youthful 43 and has the small issue of more than 500 performances for the bees in his locker.
I am a bit on, then I say that I am competitive but also realistic. I point out that I am a few stone the wrong side of Svelte. John is even older than me and he needs a new knee. He can move, but he can't turn. I also can't play on the net, because my eyesight is not good enough to pick up the ball quickly.
We are always told that Frank is the best guy in top football, full of emotional intelligence, lovable, easy to deal with. O'Connor is as good as you could meet. I think that is more than enough apologies to make them easy.
Frank and O'Connor race through the first set with 6-0. They are both in excellent condition. They are both nice players. Frank never misses an overhead. And he is both smart and good.
I play Padel as a baseball player who waves the fences. He plays like a pool player who likes to cover the bags.
Early in the second set, I have a few winners. John then tells me that he hears Frank 'Ok' in a rather a shocking way, as if he was surprised that there was still a shred of spirit left to be crushed. There were no more winners, not on our part.
There was actually one, but it didn't really count. On 6-0, 5-0, O'Connor showed a flicker of grace and Dolly a serve that we managed to send. Frank shot him a contemptuous appearance. Then no more grace. What the hell has happened with nice guy Thomas? A few minutes later it was all over: 6-0, 6-0.
Our video -man was worried that there might not be enough time to do a fast Q&A with Frank on camera at the end of the game. The game was over so quickly that he could have filmed a six -part documentary.
Yet it took a long time for a glimpse. Just long enough to detect the lead lurking under the surface of the boss who has devised a campaign in Brentford, who marks him as a manager of the seasonal candidate and one of the brightest talents in the English game.
Of course, he is a nice guy. We all know that. He is probably the most balanced, normal, decent, approachable, eloquent, smart manager in the Premier League.
He treats people with respect. He is, as one of the summary of BBC Radio 5 Live said prior to Brentford's recent victory over Manchester United, a 'beautiful person'.
“I would like to think that I am properly grounded,” says Frank, 51, earlier. “I believe in myself, but I have a favorite rule for the players about their attitude: I want them to be confident but modest.”
Even on Thursday he had told his players that if they were still Agog about the drama of the semi-final of the Champions League, they would have to save some time to view the play-off semi-final first stage between Bristol City and Sheffield United. The message: don't forget where you came from.
But there is something more. There is much more. The nice guy is good, but it has also come about that it is a bit patronizing. Because nobody reaches what Frank achieves, just by being nice. The padel -blood bath was only a small indicator of it: there is a dark side on Thomas Frank.
I ask him about Liverpool's title -winning parties after their victory over Tottenham and how refreshing it was to see Arne Slot take the microphone on the field and to thank Jurgen Klopp for his share in the triumph. How many managers are in themselves safe enough to do that?
How many have been eaten by paranoia and worries and pressure that they constantly feel the need to overdo their own part in success and to edit everyone from the story?
“First of all,” says Frank, “it was great that Slot did. The way I see the world, not necessarily the right way, I also think it was what he should have done. We are on the shoulders of others and we build on foundations that they have built for us. We have to recognize that every time.
“It's all about the ego. So how vulnerable is it or how big is it? Some people always need reassurance and to say: “The reason I am so good is because of me and it has nothing to do with these top players and good staff and such. I am, me, me, me”. So it depends on who you are.
'So you have to believe in your own skills, but be humble enough to know that there is a lot of hard work and you are not the only one. I have faith in myself and what I can do. Also modest enough to know that I can't do anything alone. Nobody can. It is impossible.
“I am who I am. You said someone on the radio said that I was a good person and that is the biggest praise you can get. For me it is much more important than being a great football coach.
'What kind of legacy do you want to leave in your life? Being a great football coach or a great person? I know what I will choose from a thousand a thousand times.
“But it doesn't have to be one or the other. Being a great coach is about being clear, directing messages, being consistent, making difficult decisions, managing the competitions. I see no reason why I can't do that.
'And I would say that the way the world changes, and changes football, it is less and less of macho management by fear now. Nobody wants that. That does not mean that you cannot be demanding. That does not mean that you cannot hammer your hand on the desk and say, “Come on, it's not good enough, you have to sprint back”.
'I can say that immediately, but I don't have to kill you. Perhaps 10 or 15 years ago that management culture was more often ahead of fear and there was a time when I was wondering if my chances could get a job, because that is not my style. But I still managed to get a job at Brondby, perhaps the biggest club in Denmark, and that went well.
'Look, if you ask if I am heavy too, I think I am extremely resilient. And we all have a dark side. I have five percent dark side in me. Even my wife says that. You need that dark side. You have to have a lead and I have a lead.
“I am extremely competitive, very determined what I want to do, and you will not survive in this company if you are not tough.”
Toughness includes many things in Frank's work at Brentford, who is the ninth in the Premier League prior to Saturday's match against relegated pswich on Portman Road. If Manchester City Crystal Palace would beat in the FA Cup final, Brentford would still have a chance to qualify for Europe for the first time in their history.
It includes the reality of the management of a selling club and dealing with losing some of your best players season after season. Until now, Frank and the brilliant network of analysts, statisticians and managers at Brentford have done that excellent work.
Loss Neal Maupay and replace him with Ollie Watkins. Sell Watkins and replace him with Ivan Toney. Sell Toney and see Bryan Mbeumo, Yoane Wissa and Kevin Schade with such a distinction.
Frank is rightly proud of the fact that Brentford is one of only three clubs in the five leading European competitions with three players in double digits for scored goals.
Brentford has Mbeumo (18 goals), Wissa (18) and damage (10); Bayern Munich have Harry Kane (24), Jamal Musiala (12), Leroy Sane (11) and Michael Olise (10); and Barcelona have Robert Lewandowski (25), Raphinha (16) and Ferran Torres (10). It is a good company to keep.
It includes dealing with the controversy that the club flooded when Toney was accused, found guilty and forbidden for gambling offenses with dignity and compassion and a hard dose of realism, refusing to sink the club.
And it includes negotiating with Aplomb the fact that he and his staff have achieved so much success at Brentford in such an impressive way that every time a vacancy for the manager in Tottenham, Chelsea, Manchester United, Bayer Leverkusen or other leading clubs is always in the frame.
The toughness also includes more personal things. The match against Ipswich marks the first birthday of the death of Frank's father, Preben. The day after he died, Frank Brentford managed in their match against Bournemouth. When Brentford scored a late winner, the players ran to Frank on the touchline and gathered around him in a show of support.
“It was very emotional,” says Frank, “and especially the first month or two after it was very emotional. One of the effects on me, I think, is that I now take more care of my mother because she is alone. Of course my sister lives in Denmark and she does that too.
'My father is no longer here and he was a big part of my life and there are still things that I wanted to talk to him about. I wish he was still here, but he was 78 years old. It's a good age.
'It is not 10 out of 10, but it was a good, long life. It all happens at some point, so I'm actually okay about it.
'Did it make me think more about my own mortality? It is more that you get those memories when people my age, you know, friends or friends of friends, unfortunately have a problem that just doesn't come out of anything.
'That is difficult, partly because I work so much, you know. I sometimes think, “What do you do about yourself,” you know, “Why are you so driven? Why are you ambitious? What do you want with your life?”
“But that's me.”
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